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blondeyny |
Fishless Cylce 7 gal |
Lead | |
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Thought I'd make it easier and start a new topic. This is the tank going through the fishless cycle with Microbe Lift ( and a squirt of Top Fin Bacterial
Supplement) 10/17 Started up tank with not enough ammonia (did 5 drops, not per gallon DUH!) 10/18 Added more ammonia A- 0 ph 7.4 (added 17 more drops ammonia)
10/19 8am test A-1.0 ph 7.4 9pm test A- 2.0 ph 7.4 (added 50 more drops of ammonia combined) 10/20 8am test -A 2.0 ish 6pm test -4.0 ish (added 20 more drops 8
am, 35 more at 6pm) 10/21 A 5.0 ish ph 7.8 Added 15 ml Microbe Lift- Day 1 10/22 A 5.0 ish ph 7.8 (no more ammonia added) 10/23 A 4.0 ish ph 7.8 10/24 A 4.0
ish, Nitrite .25, Nitrate 2.5, ph 7.4 (added squirt of bacterial supplement in morning, hours before test / added live plants in afternoon) 10/25 A 4.0 ish,
Nitrite .75, Nitrate 5, ph 7.4 10/26 A 2-4 ish, Nitrite 1.0, Nitrate 5, ph 7.8 That is where I am at so far. There have been no water changes. Any more input
would be greatly appreciated.
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tetralina3 |
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As mentioned in the other thread, I think a small waterchange (with same temp, same pH, dechlorinated water) would be in order. Just because we are not sure
if the ammonia went quite a bit above 4 or not (and we suspect it might have). You only want to do a small change so you can leave some nitrites for the bugs
to munch on.
Normally it is not a good idea to do a waterchange at this point but higher levels of ammonia can slow down a cycle so I think it is a good idea in this case. t |
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tetralina3 |
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What do you guys think?
t |
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blondeyny |
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10/27 A 4 ish, NI 1, NA 10, ph 7.8 wc of a little over 1 gal, retest A still 4 ish (but can tell there was a slight lightning of the green color) NI 1, NA 10,
ph 7.8
Adding Special Blend tomorrow after testing |
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tetralina3 |
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Okay great. As long as we know it is close to 4 (and not a lot higher) then we are good to go.
t |
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blondeyny |
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Added Special Blend then tested
10/28 A 2-4 (still getting lighter green finally) NI btwn 1-5, NA 10, ph 7.4 It's harder to read the tests when you get into the higher numbers. The colors are sometimes too similar and or they jump from 4 to 8 with nothing to judge in between. At least the ammonia looks like it's back under control now. |
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tetralina3 |
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blondeyny |
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WOO HOO!! Lookin a lot better!!
10/29 A 1.0, NI, 40-80, NA 5.0 +?, ph 7.4 11 Days, how many more ya think I got to go?? LOL |
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blondeyny |
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OK was all excited I mixed up the numbers
NA should be 40-80 and NI should be 5.0 + LOL |
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tetralina3 |
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The nitrites are spiking quite high - likely due to the high starting levels of ammonia.
It is possible that the high nitrIte reading might be affecting the nitrate results (sometimes that happens with some testers). Could you do a small, same temperature, same pH, dechlorinated waterchange? Just to lower the nitrItes and nitrates a little bit. Timing all depends on the cooperation of our buggy friends! It will be a little bit yet . . . is that vague enough? t |
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blondeyny |
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I took out a little less than a gallon and then tested. I wish I had tested prior to the wc to compare, but this is what I have now...
10/30 A .25, NI 5.0, NA 20, ph 7.4 Continue to test the water every other day for ammonia and nitrite, until you obtain a nitrite reading. This could take 1-4 weeks depending upon whether you have added some "seeded" material (gravel or filter media) from an already established and healthy tank. Continue to keep your ammonia reading at 5 ppm. Wait for the nitrite reading to drop to 0 (about 2-4 weeks into the process) at which time you should be obtaining a nitrate reading. This reading may be very high.To make sure that your tank has finished cycling, add 5ppm of ammonia, wait 24 hours, then check the levels of ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. If you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 10-20 nitrates, you're almost ready to add fish. Per fishless cycling instructions So does this mean I go and add more ammonia back in? Or just sit and wait for the NI's to zero out then add the ammonia and do the wait 24 hours part? I didn't really think about it, but I guess I am about 2 weeks into it, since I set it up on the 18th. |
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tetralina3 |
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We have to eventually change those instructions in our article.
It seems to work better to just add one dose of 5 ppm ammonia and not add any more until it gets close to zero. Then, when it is close to zero, add 2.5 ppm. Wait until it is close to zero again and add 2.5 ppm more. If you keep it consistently at 5 ppm it seems to prolong the cycle a bit. As long as there is some ammonia in the water, the buggies have something to feast on, so there is no need to keep increasing it to 5 ppm. In other words, time your ammonia additions based on the ammonia test levels and never let it get to zero. Soon the bacteria will eat 2.5 ppm in 24 hours, the nitrites will be zero, and the nitrates will be present (they already are). At that point, your tank is cycled. A couple of days to test the ammonia is eaten within 24 hours and you are ready for a big waterchange and fish. t |
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blondeyny |
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OK. I think Mac said my initial dose would have been .5 to 1 tsp of ammonia to bring it up to 5 ppm. I have a feeling at the rate it's going, the ammonia
will be at 0 at the next test. If it is, I will add about a quarter of a tsp or so to get it back up to around 2.5ppm. Then watch it again. Do you think it
seems the Special Blend is speeding things up or not? I can't really tell since I haven't really done this before.
BUT, I just thought, does it matter how much ammonia you start out with based on what or how many fish / frogs you are putting in? I am eventually putting in 4 ADF's that have been patiently waiting like I have lol |
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blondeyny |
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10/31 A 0-.25, NI 5.0, NA 10, ph 7.4
Added a quarter tsp of ammonia to hopefully bring it back up to 2.5 ppm. Will test ammonia again in a couple hours to see if it brought it up high enough. If not will add a few more drops. The NI's don't seem to be going down yet, just hanging at 5 ppm, and the NA's seem to have hung around 10-20 since I did the small wc. My boyfriend got a bottle of Nite Out II that is usually used along side the Special Blend. (he is as anxious as I am to get these frogs into their new home LOL ) Yet after seeing the test results, am wondering if I should wait and see if the ammonia will go down on it's own in 24 hours once I get it to 2.5. If it seems that it is already in the end stages of cycling, and it's just a matter of a few days, I'll just return it. If I did add it now, do you think it's too late and would make for an unstable tank? Anyone have any ideas? |
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tetralina3 |
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I don't think it would make anything unstable at least according to what I read about it.
It could be a matter of days for the cycle to end if the nitrites have peaked and we are just waiting for their drop. Nitrites usually drop fast, when they do drop. How about this idea? Wait for another two days and see what happens test-wise. Keep the product unopened and receipt ready for return (assuming you have enough time in your return period). Then we can decide. The reason I say this is because I think the product has a limited shelf life so it would be a bit of a shame to open it up and then not need it. t |
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tetralina3 |
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I forgot. If the nitrites drop really soon, then the Special Blend might have speeded things up a bit. We shall see!
t * edited to fix boo boo |
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blondeyny |
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Yeah it says it's shelf life is 18 months . I'll hold on to it for now and not do anything with it. If I can save some money here, GREAT!!!
I am having issues again getting the ammonia level up to 2.5 ppm. I had issues before getting it up to 5 ppm. Is this normally this hard or just because I didn't use ACE brand lol I added about a 1/4 of tsp, and it took it from 0-.25 to 1 in couple hours. Then added about the same amount more, and a couple hours later it was the same still. I then added more, it's been about 6 hours, and it has only bumped up a little to be 1.0-2.0. Am I not waiting long enough for the ammonia to show up? Going to add another 1/2 tsp see what that brings it up to in a couple hours. |
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blondeyny |
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11/1 A 2 ish, NI 5, NA 10, ph 7.4
OK heck with it. I found this link again http://www.drsfostersmith...a/PDF/aquarium-cycle.pdf and am going to go for it. Just worried that it won't result in a stable cycled tank if I stop using it. Like the tank would go haywire if/when I stop adding the stuff. |
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blondeyny |
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HOLY MAMMA!!! I added Nite Out II to the tank last night right after the last post (around 8 pm) This is todays test results....
11/2 A 0, NI 1.0, NA 10-20, ph 7.4 compare that to yesterday at 5:30 pm 11/1 A 2 ish, NI 5, NA 10, ph 7.4 The ammonia dropped like a rock and NI went down and NA almost doubled. So, it is doing what it's little chart said it would I guess. Nite-Out II™ acts within a day or two to lower ammonia nitrogen and nitrite nitrogen levels naturally. Specially formulated to eliminate ammonia via a natural biologic process. Nite-Out II™ is a liquid nitrifying bacteria additive that contains select strains of nitrosomonas, nitrobacter, and nitrospira. Nitrosomonas convert ammonia to nitrite while nitrospira and nitrobacter convert nitrite to nitrate, thus making the ammonia less toxic to your fish and other aquarium inhabitants. The microorganisms contained in Nite-Out II™ are able to use carbon dioxide as the sole source of carbon, and are slow-growing. The instructions said... Suggested Use Check ammonia level in aquarium. New aquariums - add 1 tsp (5 ml) per 10 gallons every other day, until ammonia level is acceptable. Established aquariums - add 1 tsp (5 ml) per 10 gallons of aquarium water after every partial water change as well as every time new fish are added to the aquarium. I added a little over 2.5 ml since I have a 7 gal. I can't believe it dropped that quick in that amount of time. So the buggies would have something to eat, I added 2.5 ml (1/2 tsp) of ammonia back in. I don't add any tonight, so will be interesting to see the test results for tomorrow! I will test the ammonia again in a little while just to see what it gets up to with 2.5 ml. I am curious what they define as an established aquarium vs new. Anyhoo...still concerned that my tank will not build a colony, but be dependent of me adding this stuff. Does that make sense? Could that happen? Oh yeah, and is what happened a good thing???? If the stuff I add gets rid of the ammonia and does all this other stuff, how am I supposed to know it's cycled???? |
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tetralina3 |
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Yes, I understand your fear about not having a stable colony due to using these products. It does make you wonder why it has to be re-added with each
waterchange. I don't usually like it when products say that. I think with some products, the tank does become dependent (such as when ammonia-removing
products are used and so the colony of ammonia-eaters doesn't get enough to eat to grow large enough).
I can see adding a product like that (assuming it works) when new fish are added because that would help boost the colony right away to the new, higher levels of fish wastes. From what was written about the product, I am not that surprised at the speed (if it really does work as they say). However, as mentioned above, we will see how stable things remain once you get all zeros for a bit and then stop adding the product. t P.S. Yes, I wonder what they define as "established". Most fish websites consider a tank that has been cycled without spikes for 6 months to be mature/established. |
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blondeyny |
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This is their official company website I guess if anyone wants more info on the products http://www.microbelift.com/
This is crazy! Just did another test to see out of curiosity ....A is 0 again. It's about 7:30 am and I raised it last night back up to 2 from 0 . It read 2.0 at 9pm. I added another tsp of ammonia. With nothing in the tank, I have to keep adding ammonia to keep the buggies fed. I'll check again tonight around 5 to see what happens. I am pondering if I want to add more Nite Out since I have to keep adding ammonia to feed the little buggers. I am supposed to add more Special Blend tomorrow. |
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